Breeders BEWARE !!!!

I'm not one to drag people through the dirt, but I know this person will do everything in her power to do what ever it takes, to who-ever has the audacity to question her in any shape or form
All I can say is for 'ALL'breeders to be aware ....and hope that people see through the crap that spills so easily from the mouth...just be very very careful of this person x

Hi Tooncats and a warm welcome to you I do indeed know we are talking about the same person. Since homing the above pup I have heard about the troubles caused in the cat world that you speak of. In fact I have an e-mail from her to me warning me that a breeder was trying to discredit her and that this breeder might try and contact me and basically to take no notice as is it was all untrue ( if you would like me to send it to you just say ), at that time her lying and true colours did not show itself so my e-mail back to her was a very sympathetic one as I myself have been wrongly accused about all and everything within our breed ( I can send that to you too if you like, in fact I might even put it up ! ). I would just like to say a big thank you for coming on here lol x

Zena wrote:Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2010 01:48:32 -0800
From: lynbarraclough@yahoo.com
Subject: Re:
To: zenadoane_1@hotmail.co.uk

Dear Zena,
re Beowulf's possible/likely undershot jaw. Firstly I am so pleased that you consider the little chap as part of your family and that you intend to keep him as so. Secondly I would like to thankyou once again for honouring the puppy contract that went with Beowulf requesting that any ailment deemed hereditary be reported back to myself the breeder. As was discussed with you on the telephone and on your visit this litter was not planned and the parents were never intended to be mated together again due to the pairing being unsuitable and producing a puppy with an undershot jaw in their previous litter (which was reported to The Utonagan Breed Registry). However as stated on in my statement on the Utonagan forum I was completely unaware that my bitch even had a season let alone 5 wks pregnant when I found out hence I could not have the pregnancy terminated. This is why I am shocked at your news as I/we were aware of it happening again and so was looking for it. What I can tell you from seeing his picture is that it is not the worse form of it and that I think it very unlikely that he will have much trouble because of it if at all but it would be reassuring for the both of us to have it checked by your vet.
You are quite correct, it is indeed hereditary and that is why I had to be very certain that the ordinary pet owner did not wish to breed and why endorsements were put on their pedigrees against them being bred and why I have encouraged pups belonging to these owners to be neutered/spayed. Despite all that has been said of me of late I take my breeding very, very seriously and I am always honest with any of it's history, again this was discussed with you , I cannot tell you how mortified I was to find out that my bitch had been caught as I had planned for her to go to an entirely different stud.

THE EYE PROBLEMS WERE DISCLOSED TO MYSELF PRIOR. THE UNDERSHOT JAW POSSIBILITY WAS NOT. SO LYNN WASNT ENTIRELY HONEST WITH US DISPITE HER CLAIMS UNTIL AFTER THE FACT.

I STILL ELECTED TO KEEP HIM AS HE IS PART OF MY FAMILY

1/ I thought you said I never kept in contact !

2/ Thank you for confirming to all that that I am a breeder that not only reports conditions but that above all else that I am honest.

3/ My e-mail that you have kindly put up has just proved that what I have been saying on here on this thread has all been true so why should anyone doubt what I have said about your boys eyes ? I think there is only one of two ways to prove who is lying Zena, either you put up a certificate of eye test that was done by your vet or put up Beowolfs microchip number and I will put up his clear puppy eye test with the same microchip number. But I already know what you are going to do don't I ?
Now that my line has been fixed I shall be contacting my vet as already stated. I am also going to contact the BVA eye board and enlighten them to this current situation.

BE ASSURED, I WILL NOT LET THIS REST !!!!!

Now that my line has been fixed I shall be contacting my vet as already stated. I am also going to contact the BVA eye board and enlighten them to this current situation.

Come on Zena...now is your chance to shoot Lyn down in flames....or her vet at least...just post the eye certificate....problem 'solved'.

If you won't ...well, then, your honesty must be questioned??!!!

Do it and then Lyn can take it further with her vet......

I know you say Beowolf will now be neutered and is just a pet but I also have a puppy that this vet passed as clear. Put all our minds at rest....

Joce you have two pups that were eye tested by the same vet. Actually my vet is the vet that has eye tested ALL my litters and adult dogs. If she can get one wrong ( according to Zena ) how many others are wrong ? No I shall not let it go.

Good...so far, I have two lovely healthy , adorable utes.

I just wanted to point out to Zena that it was not enough to say that Beowolf was now being neutered end of story...many of us have pups cleared from this vet and we need to know who is right.

I won't hold my breath for an answer but just maybe, she will do the right thing by us puppy owners....and provide the information...........If not for you Lyn but for us....her fellow puppy owners...watch this space....???!!!

She's apparently got 'form' for not honouring contracts and finding some far fetched reason as to why not, up to now we have

1. Pups on dirty bedding
2. Ear and skin mites on a puppy
3. Undisclosed undershot jaw
4. Undisclosed rosettes in eyes

All of these are the reason she says she will not honour her contract and either return Beowulf to Lyn or let Lyn find a home for him, and also why she wants full price for him

1. No one else who was there at the time saw any dirty bedding, piccies of the pups on the day they were collected show them on clean bedding
2. No other pups had ear or skin mites, the vet check didn't pick them up either
3. The vet check and an examination by Carol failed to find the undershot jaw, although this could well be developmental and may well not be the case when Beowulf reaches maturity
4. The BVA eye examination by a qualified Ophthalmic vet failed to pick up the rosettes in Beowulf's eyes, although 2 other puppies were found to have them.
5. There is no paperwork substantiating any of these claims so far

i very much doubt lyn vet is wrong,
not has been yet and merlin mia and shadows are as she said they were examined by a different eye vet, and as will stryders be done again soon, as i when got merlin ask to do them again at year or there abouts.

tooncats wrote:I'm not one to drag people through the dirt, but I know this person will do everything in her power to do what ever it takes, to who-ever has the audacity to question her in any shape or form
All I can say is for 'ALL'breeders to be aware ....and hope that people see through the crap that spills so easily from the mouth...just be very very careful of this person x

Having learned more from reading about and speaking to other genuine, competent and serious animal breeders the above post only puts it mildly about this person. What makes it even worse is that Zena has now moved on to breeding cats, it seems she has used her psychiatric nurse training to impersonate a genuine and caring animal person, she takes advantage of peoples giving and finds nothing wrong in using them to meet her own ends. She stops at nothing to get what she wants including going over breeders heads, leaving trails of lies and half truths, it seems she makes a career out of trying to destroy reputations that has taken years to build up.
Whilst it is some what comforting to know that I am not the only one that has been duped I cannot help but feel sad for the animals caught up in it all, least of all my poor pup. Like I keep saying, " I will not let this go "

Joce, I think you can rest assured that my vet has not got her diagnoses on my pups wrong, I have full faith in her and I know her well enough to know that she too when she learns about the slur against her name will not let it go either. Like I said she too is well known and is very respected not just as a vet but in her specialised field.

Just a few more things I would like to say.

First of all Beowolf does NOT live outside now. He plays outside in my garden in the daytime, not all day incidentally and also goes for walks in the park with me and the other dogs. He SLEEPS inside in the living room not outside. I now sleep on the sofa downstairs to keep him company and when Im not around my daughter sleeps downstairs so dont you dare question how I look after him.

With regards to Tooncats, its a shame that she doesnt give you the full story there either. Funnily enough I have a good reputation in the cat world and regularly steward at cat shows. I havent broken my contract with her either as when I got my breeding queen from her she was with full breeding rights, at the time she did not own a stud boy but she suggested that when the time came I returned to her for advise on a suitable stud boy (verbally). Since that point she then got a stud boy. I did not want to use him as my cats full sister and 2 half sisters were all going to the same stud boy within a 2 month period and I wanted different genetic lines. It was never written into a contract. Turns out my instincts were right there as there are health concerns over those kittens with some dying from genetic faults. When she spoke to a vet about this she LIED and said she had never lost a kitten. I notice she doesnt mention this to you either does she. If you want to know more I suggest you scroll back through this thread for my phone numbers and call me as I cant be bothered to go through the whole story online again here with yet another pointless argument. Or even mention that she tried to attack me on facebook complaining to other cat breeders and lovers about me and stating lies about my cats/pedigrees etc and inciting people to come to mine and STEAL my cat. Official complaints went into to both facebook and Felis Brittanica about her and the thread was copied and pasted with her lies and encouragement of people stealing my cats and she was shot down in flames and bollocked by the cat association and made to shut up online. If you would like a full list of the information I have on her please contact me privately and I will be happy to give it to you, including the full list of all the breeding animals she has sold/given away after 1 or 2 litters without re contacting their breeders - the amount of breeders who have privately passed me information on her etc - things I havent chosen to disclose to people as its private info but hey if she wants to attack me then lets sling that mud right back. Or even the cats she still hasnt even paid for

I still have a copy of all that thread and wall post to prove what was said incidentally. I emailed the other breeders she was telling these lies to and sent them copies of my cats pedigrees etc and every single one apologised to me in pm and never said another word on that thread.

The other email I sent Lyn about a breeder wasnt even about a breeder of any of my own animals - I dont own any of this persons animals I just got caught up in someone elses arguments so clearly I didnt break a contract there as dont own an animal from her.

Lynn says my copies of her emails state she doesnt lie? well for starters the possibility of undershot jaws was NEVER mentioned before we purchased these pups. I found this out after the fact by noticing that my dog had one and then she admitted it. One of my concerns had been totsi and harrison being penned together again when we went to pick up the pup which according to yourselves is no concern as Lynn will seperate them at the first sign of friskiness. What I find strange there then if she is so on top of these things is how come Beowolfs litter was an 'accidental mating' and she didnt even know Totsi was pregnant. Clearly missed that one then. Her emails to me state that his whole litter was being watched for these things as these genetic faults were known between totsi and harrison having previously produced a puppy with this fault - and since then the eye rosettes came out which is why the whole litter is for pet only. Has Stryder been neutered yet? as he cant be bred from either coming from - in Lynns own words faulty genetic stock which should never have been mated again in the first place, except it was an accident (from animals that are carefully monitored to prevent such accidents :\)

Lynn can persue her own vet to her hearts content. given how antangonistic you have all been to me lately over my decision to re home Beowolf - which incidentally I was doing quietly without attacking anyone - YOU attacked me first here, not the other way round, then I see no reason to co operate for your records.

Beowolf is still here with me, he hasnt been homed, and I am still continuing to work through his problems with him.

Quote " Just a few more things I would like to say.

First of all Beowolf
does NOT live outside now. He plays outside in my garden in the
daytime, not all day incidentally and also goes for walks in the park
with me and the other dogs. He SLEEPS inside in the living room not
outside. I now sleep on the sofa downstairs to keep him company and
when Im not around my daughter sleeps downstairs so dont you dare
question how I look after him. " unquote,

Zena please find a post of mine where I have said such things such as those you have mentioned above

Quote " With regards to Tooncats " Did I mention who I have spoken too ?

Quote" I did not want to use him as my cats full sister and 2 half sisters
were all going to the same stud boy within a 2 month period and I wanted
different genetic lines. It was never written into a contract. Turns
out my instincts were right there as there are health concerns over
those kittens with some dying from genetic faults. When she spoke to a
vet about this she LIED and said she had never lost a kitten. I notice
she doesnt mention this to you either does she." unquote

Mmm!! Another breeder with genetic faults, oh and ANOTHER breeder who lies eh ! Golly Zena how many more are you going to come up with ?

Quote " The other email I sent Lyn about a breeder wasnt even about a breeder of
any of my own animals - I dont own any of this persons animals I just
got caught up in someone elses arguments so clearly I didnt break a
contract there as dont own an animal from her.
So why on earth did you involve me in it ? Were you worried that something would come out ? If you remember I gave you a very sincere and supportive e-mail reply back but that of course was when I was oblivious to your true character. Hey ho ! ! will get over it but will my poor pup I can put that e-mail up for you at your request if you like.

Quote " Lynn says my copies of her emails state she doesn't lie? well for
starters the possibility of undershot jaws was NEVER mentioned before we
purchased these pups. I found this out after the fact by noticing that
my dog had one and then she admitted it. "

Of course it was not mentioned, he was not diagnosed as having one Please tell me where the lie is in that ! If I am to be believed to be such an uncaring, lying breeder who according to you also raises puppies in such filthy conditions why oh why would I even bother to tell you in my e-mail (that you have kindly put up )about my previous litter ? and why oh why did you continue with the purchase and why if you feel that strongly about the pups conditions did you not report me ?

Quote " What I find strange there then if she is so on top of these things is
how come Beowolfs litter was an 'accidental mating' and she didn't even
know Totsi was pregnant. Clearly missed that one then. Her emails to
me state that his whole litter was being watched for these things as
these genetic faults were known between totsi and Harrison having
previously produced a puppy with this fault - and since then the eye
rosettes came out which is why the whole litter is for pet only."

Be careful Zena, everybody and I mean everybody knows all about Harrison and Totsi and their bond ( they have become some what of a legend for it ), their history of couplings and the great lengths to which I have gone to stop them if seen, including my vet. It is all on here and documented on T.U.B.R. records and records at my vets. I feel no need to justify to you on here. I am sure if you ask nicely admin will put up the link/s of the thread related to Beowolf's litter and the unseen mating, if your extra nice she might put up one of threads from the time before showing you pictures of the great lengths that I went to ( remember the underpants and sanitary pads and belts folks ? ).

Oh Zena you know fine well why Carol has got Stryder and so does T.U.B.R, you also know the reasons why Carol was en trusted with him. I just thank my lucky stars that it was not you I trusted for our program.

Quote "Lynn can persue her own vet to her hearts content. "

Oh I will Zena !

Quote " given how antangonistic you have all been to me lately over my decision
to re home Beowolf - which incidentally I was doing quietly without
attacking anyone - YOU attacked me first here, not the other way round,
then I see no reason to co operate for your records."

I attacked you !!! I was fuming, concerned and upset that you did not contact me about your decision to re home/sell him yes, so sorry if you think that is what at taking means to you but that's not what my dictionary tells me about the word attacking. As for co operating for my records, mm ! did I not predict in my post that you would not do it, the reason is not for the one you give above is it Zena ? Of course it's not, the real reason is because you have no such eye certificate or vets letter confirming that my vet was wrong. We on here all know that.

Quote "Beowolf is still here with me, he hasn't been homed, and I am still continuing to work through his problems with him.

Beowolf has but one major problem and that is you Zena, pride and lies should not be the reason for not thinking of his immediate and long term welfare.

I am absolutely fuming to learn from Carol on here that one of my
puppies ( her Stryders litter brother ) from Totsi and Harrisons last
litter is up for re homing/sale without my knowledge, no contact from
his owner whats so ever, you all know him as Beowolf/ Zena being his
owner and friend of Diane with Hobo. My e-mail has not changed nor has
my number that she has for me. Beowolf, unlike Hobo has not been
neutered as asked. Yes he did go with a contract. I have no idea what
the hell is going on , I am most upset and very disappointed at finding
out via a friend who saw it advertised on FACE BOOK .
I feel most betrayed as I gave this person the benefit of the doubt
because she came recommended via some one I trusted. I have not
contacted her yet as I am too upset and feel utterly let down.
I
just want breeders to know that no matter how careful and thorough you
are about your babies people are not always what they seem. I guess the
moral to my situation is that I should have gone with my gut instinct.
Sorry, rant over, I am just so terribly upset.

Just to remind you Zena of my first post, I think the words you are
looking for are upset, betrayal and anger at such betrayal and not the
word attack.

Admin
Admin



Number of posts: 8452
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Location: U.K
Reputation: 36
Points: 8046
Registration date: 2008-09-22


Subject: Re: Breeders BEWARE !!!! Sat 1 Oct 2011 - 10:59
There is quite a lot more to come out Carol, got some very interesting emails from people in the cat world, she is well known, but for the wrong reasons. Waiting for permissions to put it on here.
Did Zena mention Beowulf is living outside now by the way, no I thought not. Weather nice and warm at the moment, but has he adequate housing and proper bedding for when it turns cold I wonder.
I understand there are more cats than is practicable as well.

Zena wrote:

Admin
Admin



Number of posts: 8452
Age: 62
Location: U.K
Reputation: 36
Points: 8046
Registration date: 2008-09-22


Subject: Re: Breeders BEWARE !!!! Sat 1 Oct 2011 - 10:59
There is quite a lot more to come out Carol, got some very interesting emails from people in the cat world, she is well known, but for the wrong reasons. Waiting for permissions to put it on here.
Did Zena mention Beowulf is living outside now by the way, no I thought not. Weather nice and warm at the moment, but has he adequate housing and proper bedding for when it turns cold I wonder.
I understand there are more cats than is practicable as well.

That is not my post Zena, it is Admin's/Junes
I have not seen or read the e-mails that June has received, please take that up with her. I only talk of what I know, have seen or been told.

Zena wrote:Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2010 01:48:32 -0800
From: lynbarraclough@yahoo.com
Subject: Re:
To: zenadoane_1@hotmail.co.uk

Dear Zena,
re Beowulf's possible/likely undershot jaw. Firstly I am so pleased that you consider the little chap as part of your family and that you intend to keep him as so. Secondly I would like to thankyou once again for honouring the puppy contract that went with Beowulf requesting that any ailment deemed hereditary be reported back to myself the breeder. As was discussed with you on the telephone and on your visit this litter was not planned and the parents were never intended to be mated together again due to the pairing being unsuitable and producing a puppy with an undershot jaw in their previous litter (which was reported to The Utonagan Breed Registry). However as stated on in my statement on the Utonagan forum I was completely unaware that my bitch even had a season let alone 5 wks pregnant when I found out hence I could not have the pregnancy terminated. This is why I am shocked at your news as I/we were aware of it happening again and so was looking for it. What I can tell you from seeing his picture is that it is not the worse form of it and that I think it very unlikely that he will have much trouble because of it if at all but it would be reassuring for the both of us to have it checked by your vet.
You are quite correct, it is indeed hereditary and that is why I had to be very certain that the ordinary pet owner did not wish to breed and why endorsements were put on their pedigrees against them being bred and why I have encouraged pups belonging to these owners to be neutered/spayed. Despite all that has been said of me of late I take my breeding very, very seriously and I am always honest with any of it's history, again this was discussed with you , I cannot tell you how mortified I was to find out that my bitch had been caught as I had planned for her to go to an entirely different stud.

THE EYE PROBLEMS WERE DISCLOSED TO MYSELF PRIOR. THE UNDERSHOT JAW POSSIBILITY WAS NOT. SO LYNN WASNT ENTIRELY HONEST WITH US DISPITE HER CLAIMS UNTIL AFTER THE FACT.

I STILL ELECTED TO KEEP HIM AS HE IS PART OF MY FAMILY

As Stryder is not a quote" ordinary pet" and is NOT showing any signs of any problems, but yes he still has these enorsements on.
[as all ours breeders puppies have until all been checked and health tests done]
AND UNTIL STRYDER HAS BEEN CLEARED BY A VET AND HAS ALL HIS HEALTH TESTS DONE, AND YES ANOTHER EYE TEST.
They will stay on

Quote "Lynn can persue her own vet to her hearts content. "

Quote " I see no reason to co operate for your records."

my focus is not on his eyes and jaw as they are not an issue to me, the vet advised they would cause him no problems so I never worried about these. Hes not a breeding boy so I am not persuing these issues.

How uterlly SELFISH of you!!

As a breeder of cats are you not conserned about thier health? even when in pet homes? do you just sweep pet owned cats health problems under the carpet? saying they are not of any consern as they are not being bred from? because thats what it sounds like to me!

As I see it you owe it to your dog to show that you have documented proof of what you are saying! If you care for animals then that IS the reason to co-operate!


However I feel that there are no such documents like Lyn says,

However I feel that there are no such documents like Lyn says,

It does rather look like that doesn't it!!!

Quote " How uterlly SELFISH of you!!

Yes it is Karen, not only is it very selfish to those you have mentioned but I find it very vindictive towards my vet and my pup owners, least of all me. I find it very hard for a so called professionally qualified psychiatric nurse to be so openly accusing and disrespectful to another professional without substantial evidence or proof.

A few years down the line, and these alleged 'health issues' will be touted around as absolute total fact - that is the problem. I know exactly what is and isn't fact, fact is documented, non-fact is un-documented. I am still waiting for these documented facts, never mind Lyn pursuing HER vet, I doubt very much whether her vet is wrong on the eyes, and the undershot jaw wasn't there at health check, so with not being a psychic vet and being able to see into the future, she was unable to diagnose it. However your vet IS in a situation where it can be diagnosed, and is also in a position to substantiate the eye rosette claim and supply relevant documentation. Too many of these witch hunts have been started without any proof apart from heresay for me to believe anything but correct documentation of anything and everything.
So yes, you are either selfish or not telling the truth, whichever one of them you are, you need to think about if it was a kitten you had homed, how would you feel being told that there were things wrong healthwise that hadn't shown up prior to homing, but the owner refused to let you have documented evidence. You would be up the creek without a paddle, being unable to move forward in your breeding programme because you weren't totally sure of where the truth lay.

Quote " So yes, you are either selfish or not telling the truth, whichever
one of them you are, you need to think about if it was a kitten you had
homed, how would you feel being told that there were things wrong
healthwise that hadn't shown up prior to homing, but the owner refused
to let you have documented evidence. You would be up the creek without a
paddle, being unable to move forward in your breeding programme because
you weren't totally sure of where the truth lay."

That is exactly why you chose to do it was it not Zena ?
You clash with me because I show up everything you are not, just a case of mirror refection !
Being honest with yourself takes courage, admitting that you are wrong means putting aside your pride but to admit that you have lied to save face takes bravery.

Zena, I'll give you £100 for Beowolf, I'll drive up at my own cost and bring him back to a caring environment.

I'll have him fully checked out at the Veterinary College in Potters Bar, get him DNA'd and take him to Professor Peter Bedford for a FULL eye examination.

Then I will get him Neutered and find a loving home for him.

BUT, I would publish all results, warts and all !


Up to you now!

Sorry, getting tired of this thread, enough bitching, let's consider the welfare of Beowolf as paramount?

Not only HIS welfare Vince, but what about the old dog, the newfoundlandxpyrannean puppy and all those cats??? There are a lot of people in the cat world also concerned about what is going on, lot of animals to cope with there if you think about it.
I think your offer is more than generous, and I really hope and pray she takes you up on it. I wish I could make the offer, I have thought about it, but have got Zillar in season, Lona thinking about it and very little space for another large entire dog, plus I have a feeling he will need taking back to beyond square one as regards training and I really don't know if I can take another on at the same time as Zillar, or if I have the ability to do anything constructive for him.
Just a case of Zena being willing to give him up to you so's you can give him a fresh start really now

Thankyou so much for your kind offer Vince but I fear it is too late as I have noticed that Zena's adverts have all been taken down for him. I very much doubt that she will even come on here anymore.
I know that one day I WILL FIND him. I am working right on it now by doing a " have you got this dog " with his details and pic and urging them to kindly contact me. I shall be asking all with a website if they would put it up for me. I just want to know he is safe, well and in a loving home.

I hope he turns up safe and sound in a lovely home Lyn, he deserves it!!!!